Hi Herbie (and users of PDF with bitmaps), I have posted at <http://lcs98.free.fr/study/> the file "study.pdf" that you recently announced on Sun, 24 Jan 2010 17:13:31 +0100. and backchannelled to me. It seems you created it with the 8.2 version of Adobe Acrobat using the corresponding "Image Conversion Plugin". The PDF version is 1.6. Your "study.pdf" has exactly the efficiency of TIF-G4 (the fax group 4 variant of TIF). But the packaging of it is certainly not exactly the most common, since a program "PDF2TIFF" that I once bought extracts nothing from it. Maybe a new variant of TIF-G4 is involved. At any rate, the slow 20 sec embedding speed you mention is a sure sign that Distiller _repackaged_ my TIF files in creating your PDF; indeed, certain other means of embedding such as "c42pdf" are nearly instantaneous. Have you any further explanation of all this? I extracted the bitmap files using Open Office (by the recipe I have posted); and then I verified that they are bit-for-bit exactly the original "study" bitmaps. Thus, for the embedding of TIFF-G4 bilevel bitmaps, Distiller has caught up with the competition. But what about _extraction_ by Distiller/Acrobat of bilevel bitmaps from PDF. In particular, is your Distiller Pro 8.2 able to extract the bitmaps from "study.pdf"? Also I wonder whether you harvest them as TIFF_G4s? In the extraction procedure of Open Office, there is a loss of page order; restoring it is a real pain, indeed a forbidding task if there are hundreds or thousands of pages. (FileJuicer is OK here!) Finally I was surprised to hear that Adobe is again offering academic discounts; what percentage can one expect? Cheers, Laurent S.