Dale, Some good thoughts in your post. I find myself usually in general agreement with your thoughts and appreciate the things you share here. The thing that bothers me is your characterization of IFB. Seems you have a hang up there for some reason. I have no identification with nor did I know anything about them until being on this forum. When I look at your posts and those from the IFB brothers I see almost identical truth being presented....... except that when IFB is mentioned you react like a bull to a red flag. The accusations you leveled in the previous post would fit many SBC churches and pastors I know, therefore are not accurate in their generalizations. Possibly I am missing something. Help me see through this obvious antagonism Dean ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dale Gooding" <prosperityfbc@...> To: <pastorsforum@...> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:20 PM Subject: RE: [PastorsForum] A Preachers Voice Question Steve, Brothers is a great book, we all need to read it. I am afraid too many IFB preachers either do not know what real worship is, are afraid to do it on Sundays, or think it is not for Sundays. I am not talking about a bunch of 7 word stanzas sung 11 times type songs but asking the Lord to and expecting Him to create an atmosphere of worship through His word and Spirit while at the same time giving both an evangelical push for sinners and a educational experience for believers. I hear too many preachers suggesting that if the people aren't coming out either happy they aren't guilty of whatever the preacher is preaching or have had their spiritual feet stomped on by the same then they haven't heard any "good preachin". No wonder much of the IFB movement is in the shape it is in. DG -----Original Message----- From: Steven G. Rockhill [mailto:revrock@...] Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:18 PM To: pastorsforum@... Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] A Preachers Voice Question Dale, Thanks for this post. I really like the idea of 'worship' being included in the preaching. That is what the folks were missing in the Ezekiel passage that Dean posted earlier (Btw Thanks for that post Dean, great passage). I totally agree with you here brother. BTW - I am reading Piper's "Brothers, We are not professionals" book for a book discussion group with fellow pastors. I am still early in it, but it has been excellent. Peace, Steve Dale Gooding wrote: > DW, > Sorry to be so long getting back to you. > No, I don't have a voice for my wife, children or anyone else. And > no, I don't simply "talk" a sermon, I preach. But preaching doesn't, I > believe, have to take on some sort of special voice. Who says urgency > has to be accompanied with volume or a draw, or a hack, or anything > else? > Dishonest, Yes! I think it is dishonest to be something in the pulpit > you are not outside of the pulpit. I have seen preachers start a sermon > by screaming "open yo Bibles" and end with a loud "Amen" all the while > they hardly, if at all, stopped yelling. Now I know some see that as > "goooooooood preachin' ". I do not and I came from a school that was > full of people like that. I will guarantee you there is urgency and > fervency in my messages. There is also worship, education, illustration > and application in them. I am, and will be all my life I am sure, > studying to be an expository preacher to the inth degree. I am not > afraid of anyone except for having a holy fear of God. I can prove that > by using my church as an example. We were a dying "we ain't never done > it that way / we four and no more" type church with 55 members. Now we > have 85 (only a handful of the old members) and only 2 of the five > deacons that were here are still here and one isn't active. Now I > didn't "run" anyone off but refused to be wagged by the proverbial tail. > So, no I am not an orator, devil or deacon whipped or anything else. I > am authoritative although not dictatorial. > For example, did Jesus preach according to your example to the woman at > the well in Jn. 4 or did he bring her into conviction and worship as the > Master Evangelist? I preach "hard" and can be loud but do not have to > be obnoxious or pretentious to do so. Preaching power is not in volume > or voluminousness but in God's power. I think it was Hitler who said > "say it loud enough and long enough and the people will believe it." > That's not needed here. > > DG > > -----Original Message----- > From: Pastor David Warner [mailto:dwarner@...] > Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 10:59 AM > To: pastorsforum@... > Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] A Preachers Voice Question > > > DG, > Do yo have a "voice" when you whisper sweet nothings into your wife's > ear? Or how about a "voice" when you have to really get after the > kids. My "voice" is different in many places. Dishonest? What on > earth does that mean in this context? Please explain your use of it. > Actually, I've heard way too many "talking" preachers that seemed to > have no real conviction about what they were saying. There was no > urgency in their "voice" and they seemed to be just delivering a > homily. They acted like they were scared of the devil or the deacons or > > de-crowd (sorry, had to have another d for my outline) Well, if they > are > > going to preach, then PREACH! Or just shut up and sit down and save > their talk for the garden club. > > DW > > > Dale Gooding wrote: > > >>Ray, >>My opinion is that your analysis and DP's response is correct. I too >>have noticed the same thing and wondered if some guys are either trying > > >>to be theatrical or be like their favorite preacher. When I went to >>Bible college I hardly knew the difference between Moses and Abraham. >>In my homiletics class the prof. had each of us preach for a few >>minutes. I noticed it for the first time then. These guys were, I >>perceived, really playing it up. I noticed also that many times they >>would come from the pulpit with what seemed to be a little arrogancy >>for a few minutes. I didn't preach in that class because I was a >>little confused. What I did realize was that I was not going to be >>someone else in the pulpit, I was going to be me. Do I get loud? Yes, >>when it is called for. Do I get a little faster at times? Yes, when >>it is called for. But I never "put on" my "preacher's voice". >>Crying out loud is, I believe, different that having some particular >>voice in the pulpit. Seems dishonest to me. >> >>DG >>I Cor. 15:58 >> >>-- -- To unsubscribe, send ANY message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... "In essential things, unity; in non-essential things, liberty; and in all things, charity." -- To unsubscribe, send ANY message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... "In essential things, unity; in non-essential things, liberty; and in all things, charity."