Excellent Kevin. Craig Ledbetter Ireland www.biblebc.com -----Original Message----- From: Kevin Sigafoos [mailto:ksigafoos@...] Sent: 22 August 2006 21:04 To: pastorsforum@... Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] please help Hi DJ, Maybe it would help if we examine one verse at a time. Which one would you like to discuss first? Generally, I think that the "those who endure til the end" verses are referring to the evidence of salvation and not the means of salvation. That is, we will know who was saved BY THE FACT that they endure until the end. Note that this is different than saying that a man will be saved BECAUSE he endured until the end. I think 1 John 2:19 sheds light on this: They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us. (1Jo 2:19) The whole purpose of 1 John was to comfort the disciples that were being tested by false teachers. Over and over, John gives them "tests" to see if they were in the faith. But in 2:19 he says, "You didn't follow these false teachers, did you? No. You didn't believe the lies, did you? No. That proves that you are a true believer." I'm not sure that I agree with Pastor Hughes statement that started this discussion: "it helps me to know that I don't have to hold out faithful to the end to retain my salvation." I think that the teaching of Scripture is that it is not our obedience that results in our salvation. Rather our obedience is a result of our salvation. So a Christian need not "hold out faithful to the end to retain [his] salvation" yet he most assuredly will "hold out faithful to the end" because he is saved. Hope this helps. -- Grace and peace, Kevin Sigafoos --------------------- For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be glory forever. Amen. (Rom 11:36) To subscribe, send any message to:pastorsforum-join@... To unsubscribe, send any message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... Eph.4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.