I am sorry, I know you intended this for information and not discussion, .... but I have to make some comments. First, while I pray for Mr Obama as a leader of the government in our nation, there are ominous clouds on the horizon. >>>>This is the man of deep Christian faith. Is there any evidence that Mr Obama is a born again believer, trusting Christ as Lord and Savior???? If he were arrested for being a Christian, what evidence would convict him??? Certainly his friendship with the Catholic priest, the Rev. Michael Pfleger would not, nor his membership of the Church of Christ espousing Black Liberation Theology. Actually, membership in no church has the power to save the lost. According to interviews President-Elect Obama has done recently, he is a Universalist, and NOT a Bible-believing Christian trusting Christ Jesus and Him alone for salvation. His version of Christian faith is a religion of works counting on good deeds to take him to heaven, if there is a heaven. There are very serious issues regarding Mr Obama's so-called Christian faith. "I'm rooted in the Christian tradition," said Obama. He then adds something most Christians will see as universalism: "I believe there are many paths to the same place, and that is a belief that there is a higher power, a belief that we are connected as a people." In his 1993 memoir, Dreams from My Father: A Story of Race and Inheritance, Obama describes his mother as "a lonely witness for secular humanism." "My mother's confidence in needlepoint virtues depended on a faith I didn't possess, a faith that she would refuse to describe as religious; that, in fact, her experience told her was sacrilegious: a faith that rational, thoughtful people could shape their own destiny," he says in the book. Obama doesn't believe he, or anyone else, will go to hell. But he's not sure if he'll be going to heaven, either. "I don't presume to have knowledge of what happens after I die," he says. "When I tuck in my daughters at night, and I feel like I've been a good father to them, and I see in them that I am transferring values that I got from my mother and that they're kind people and that they're honest people, and they're curious people, that's a little piece of heaven." A Christian columnist, Cal Thomas, wrote, Here's Obama again: "I don't presume to have knowledge of what happens after I die. When I tuck in my daughters at night and I feel like I've been a good father to them, and I see that I am transferring values that I got from my mother and that they're kind people and that they're honest people, and they're curious people, that's a little piece of heaven." Any first-year seminary student could deconstruct such "works salvation" and wishful thinking. Obama either hasn't read the Bible, or if he has, doesn't believe it if he embraces such thin theological wisps. Obama can call himself anything he likes, but there is a clear requirement for one to qualify as a Christian and Obama doesn't meet that requirement. One cannot deny central tenets of the Christian faith, including the deity and uniqueness of Christ as the sole mediator between God and Man and be a Christian. Such people do have a label applied to them in Scripture. They are called "false prophets." Mr Obama said, "Let's not play games, what I was suggesting - you're absolutely right that John McCain has not talked about my Muslim faith. And you're absolutely right that that has not come." Matthew 12:34 says: "For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks." Obama didn't correct himself. He was "corrected" by George Stephanopoulos who interrupted Obama, with the words: "Christian faith." In a Feb. 27, 2007, interview with the New York Times' Nicholos Kristof, that's how Obama described the Muslim call to prayer. That prayer, which Obama recited with a "first-class [Arabic] accent," begins with this: Allah is supreme! Allah is supreme! Allah is supreme! Allah is supreme! I witness that there is no god but Allah I witness that there is no god but Allah I witness that Muhammad is his prophet ... in January 1968, Obama was registered as a Muslim at his primary school under the name Barry Soetoro. The Associated Press has released a photocopy of the document where Barack Obama is registered as an Indonesian citizen of the Muslim religion. Mr Obama also claimed he never attended a mosque. Eyewitnesses say otherwise. Childhood friends and even his school principal said they saw Obama attend the mosque with their own eyes. In response, the Obama campaign issued a statement: Instead of claiming Obama was never a Muslim, as they had previously posted, they then claimed he "has never been a practicing Muslim." In Obama's autobiography, "Dreams From My Father," he called his school "a Muslim school" and admits he studied the Quran during his formative years from age 6 to age 10: "In the Muslim school, the teacher wrote to tell mother I made faces during Quranic studies." He could have never made faces in Quranic studies if he wasn't studying the Quran. In June 13, 2008, Obama's half brother, Malik Obama, who lives in Kenya, told the Jerusalem Post that "if elected his brother will be a good president for the Jewish people despite his Muslim background." Mr Obama has been supported some notorious Muslin groups, such as Al-Qaida, Hamas, and Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad, and the Muslim Brotherhood. Islamic websites are calling Obama the "first Muslim president of the United States." It is claimed by some in these Muslin groups the Mr Obama is without doubt a Muslim, and that if he had renounced his Muslim affiliation he would have changed his Muslim name. Mr Obama has never renounced his Muslim affiliation and upbringing. Have you ever wondered why it is that the Islamic world has not renounced Mr Obama for becoming a Christian, a capital offense under Shariah law???? I have not read of a single Islamic extremist calling for his death as an apostate from Islam. BTW, there are many who say that Mr Obama's eligibility as a candidate for president is in dispute because he has not produced an authentic birth certificate. It is claimed that he was born in Hawaii, yet his grandmother states he was born in Kenya. Jerry "And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen." (Mark 16:20). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Edwin Hill" <ehillnewlife@...> To: <pastor2pastor@...>; <pastormail@...>; <pastormail@...>; <pastormail@...>; <pastorsforum-sc.1114066497.mchelofjhgnjkcndcjel-ehillnewlife=yahoo.com@...>; <pastorsforum@...> Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2008 4:11 PM Subject: [PastorsForum] Fw: Obama Will Be One of the Greatest (and Most Loved) American Presidents > Here group is an interesting article that was sent to me. I am seeking > neither discussion nor comment;neither argument nor opinion - it's just an > article that I found interesting and thought I would share it. > God bless all of you. > Ed Hill,Sr > > > --- On Fri, 11/14/08, JAB <jbsurvine@...> wrote: > >> From: JAB <jbsurvine@...> >> Subject: Fw: Obama Will Be One of the Greatest (and Most Loved) American >> Presidents >> To: "Edwin Hill" <ehillnewlife@...> >> Date: Friday, November 14, 2008, 1:50 AM >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: LeslieEn@... >> To: jbsurvine@... >> Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 4:19 PM >> Subject: Obama Will Be One of the Greatest (and Most Loved) >> American Presidents >> >> >> >> Obama Will Be One of The Greatest (and Most Loved) American >> Presidents >> >> Frank Schaeffer, (Republican) author of Crazy For God >> >> Great presidents are made great by horrible >> circumstances combined with character, temperament and >> intelligence. Like firemen, cops, doctors or soldiers, >> presidents need a crisis to shine. Obama is one of the most >> intelligent presidential aspirants to ever step forward in >> American history. The likes of his intellectual capabilities >> have not been surpassed in public life since the Founding >> Fathers put pen to paper. His personal character is also >> solid gold. Take heart, America : we have the leader for our >> times. >> >> I say this as a white, former life-long Republican. I >> say this as the proud father of a Marine. I say this as just >> another American watching his pension evaporate along with >> the stock market! I speak as someone who knows it's >> time to forget party loyalty, ideology and pride and put the >> country first. I say this as someone happy to be called a >> fool for going out on a limb and declaring that, 1) Obama >> will win, and 2) he is going to be amongst the greatest of >> American presidents. Obama is our last best chance. >> He's worth laying it all on the line for. >> >> This is a man who in the age of greed took the high >> road of community service. This is the good father and >> husband. This is the humble servant. This is the patient >> teacher. This is the scholar statesman. This is the man of >> deep Christian faith. >> >> >> Good stories about Obama abound; from his personal >> relationship with his Secret Service agents (he invites them >> into his home to watch sports, and shoots hoops with them) >> to the story about how, more than twenty years ago, while >> standing in the check-in line at an airport, Obama paid a >> $100 baggage surcharge for a stranger who was broke and >> stuck. (Obama was virtually penniless himself in those >> days.) Years later after he became a senator, that stranger >> recognized Obama's picture and wrote to him to thank >> him. She received a kindly note back from the senator. (The >> story only surfaced because the person, who lives in Norway >> , told a local newspaper after Obama ran for the presidency. >> The paper published a photograph of this lady proudly >> displaying Senator Obama's letter.) >> >> Where many leaders are two-faced; publicly kindly >> but privately feared and/or hated by people closest to them, >> Obama is consistent in the way he treats people, >> consistently kind and personally humble. He lives by the >> code that those who lead must serve. He believes that. He >> lives it. He lived it long before he was in the public eye. >> >> Obama puts service ahead of ideology. He also knows >> that to win politically you need to be tough. He can be. He >> has been. This is a man who does what works, rather than >> scoring ideological points. In other words he is the >> quintessential non-ideological pragmatic American. He will >> (thank God!) disappoint ideologues and purists of the left >> and the right. >> >> Obama has a reservoir of personal physical courage >> that is unmatched in presidential history. Why unmatched? >> Because as the first black contender for the presidency who >> will win, Obama, and all the rest of us, know that he is in >> great physical danger from the seemingly unlimited reserve >> of unhinged racial hatred, and just plain unhinged ignorant >> hatred, that swirls in the bowels of our wounded and sinful >> country. By stepping forward to lead, Obama has literally >> put his life on the line for all of us in a way no white >> candidate ever has had to do. (And we all know how dangerous >> the presidency has been even for white presidents.) >> Nice stories or even unparalleled courage isn't >> the only point. The greater point about Obama is that the >> midst of our worldwide financial meltdown, an expanding (and >> losing) war in Afghanistan, trying to extricate our country >> from a wrong and stupidly mistaken ruinously expensive war >> in Iraq, our mounting and crushing national debt, awaiting >> the next (and inevitable) al Qaeda attack on our homeland, >> watching our schools decline to Third World levels of >> incompetence, facing a general loss of confidence in the >> government that has been exacerbated by the Republicans >> doing all they can to undermine our government's >> capabilities and programs... President Obama will take on >> the leadership of our country at a make or break time of >> historic proportions. He faces not one but dozens of crises, >> each big enough to define any presidency in better times. >> >> As luck, fate or divine grace would have it >> (depending on one's personal theology) Obama is >> blessedly, dare I say uniquely, well-suited to our dire >> circumstances. Obama is a person with hands-on community >> service experience, deep connections to top economic >> advisers from the renowned University of Chicago where he >> taught law, and a middle-class background that gives him an >> abiding knowledgeable empathy with the rest of us. As the >> son of a single mother, who has worked his way up with merit >> and brains, recipient of top-notch academic scholarships, >> the peer-selected editor of the Harvard Law Review and, in >> three giant political steps to state office, national office >> and now the presidency, Obama clearly has the wit and drive >> to lead. >> >> Obama is the sober voice of reason at a time of >> unreason. He is the fellow keeping his head while all around >> him are panicking. He is the healing presence at a time of >> national division and strife. He is also new enough to the >> political process so that he doesn't suffer from the >> terminally jaded cynicism, the seen-it-all-before syndrome >> afflicting most politicians in Washington. In that regard we >> Americans lucked out. It's as if having despaired of our >> political process we picked a name from the phone book to >> lead us and that person turned out to be the very man we >> needed. >> >> Obama brings a healing and uplifting spiritual >> quality to our politics at the very time when our worst >> enemy is fear. For eight years we've been ruled by a >> stunted fear-filled mediocrity of a little liar who has >> expanded his power on the basis of creating fear in others. >> Fearless Obama is the cure. He speaks a litany of hope >> rather than a litany of terror. >> >> As we have watched Obama respond in a quiet >> reasoned manner to crisis after crisis, in both the way he >> has responded after being attacked and lied about in the >> 2008 campaign season, to his reasoned response to our >> multiplying national crises, what we see is the spirit of a >> trusted family doctor with a great bedside manner. Obama is >> perfectly suited to hold our hand and lead us through some >> very tough times. The word panic is not in the Obama >> dictionary. >> >> America is fighting its "Armageddon" in >> one fearful heart at a time. A brilliant leader with the >> mild manner of an old-time matter-of-fact country doctor >> soothing a frightened child is just what we need. The fact >> that our "doctor" is a black man leading a >> hitherto white-ruled nation out of the mess of its own >> making is all the sweeter and raises the Obama story to that >> of moral allegory. >> >> Obama brings a moral clarity to his leadership >> reserved for those who have had to work for everything >> they've gotten and had to do twice as well as the person >> standing next to them because of the color of their skin. >> His experience of succeeding in spite of his color, social >> background and prejudice could have been embittering or one >> that fostered a spiritual rebirth of forgiveness and >> enlightenment. Obama radiates the calm inner peace of the >> spirit of forgiveness. >> >> Speaking as a believing Christian I see the hand of >> a merciful God in Obama's candidacy. The biblical >> metaphors abound. The stone the builder rejected is become >> the cornerstone... the last shall be first... he that would >> gain his life must first lose it... the meek shall inherit >> the earth... >> For my secular friends I'll allow that we may have just >> been extraordinarily lucky! Either way America wins. >> >> Only a brilliant man, with the spirit of a >> preacher and the humble heart of a kindly family doctor can >> lead us now. We are afraid, out of ideas, and worst of all >> out of hope. Obama is the cure. And we Americans have it in >> us to rise to the occasion. We will. We're about to >> enter one of the most frightening periods of American >> history. Our country has rarely faced more uncertainty. This >> is the time for greatness. We have a great leader. We must >> be a great people backing him, fighting for him, sacrificing >> for a cause greater than ourselves. >> >> A hundred years from now Obama's portrait will >> be placed next to that of George Washington, Abraham Lincoln >> and Franklin Roosevelt. Long before that we'll be >> telling our children and grandchildren that we stepped out >> in faith and voted for a young black man who stood up and >> led our country back from the brink of an abyss. We'll >> tell them about the power of love, faith and hope. We'll >> tell them about the power of creativity combined with >> humility and intellectual brilliance. We'll tell them >> that President Obama gave us the gift of regaining our faith >> in our country. We'll tell them that we all stood up and >> pitched in and won the day. We'll tell them that >> President Obama restored our standing in the world. >> >> We'll tell them that by the time he left office >> our schools were on the mend, our economy booming, that >> we'd become a nation filled with green energy >> alternatives and were leading the world away from dependence >> on carbon-based destruction. We'll tell them that >> because of President Obama's example and leadership the >> integrity of the family was restored, divorce rates went >> down, more fathers took responsibility for their children, >> and abortion rates fell dramatically as women, families and >> children were cared for through compassionate social >> programs that worked. >> >> >> >> We'll tell them about how the gap closed >> between the middle class and the super rich, how we won >> health care for all, how crime rates fell, how bad wars were >> brought to an honorable conclusion. We'll tell them that >> when we were attacked again by al Qaeda, how reason >> prevailed and the response was smart, tough, measured and >> effective, and our civil rights were protected even in times >> of crisis.. >> >> We'll tell them that we were part of the >> inexplicably blessed miracle that happened to our country >> those many years ago in 2008 when a young black man was sent >> by God, fate or luck to save our country. We'll tell >> them that it's good to live in America where anything is >> possible. Yes we will. >> >> Frank Schaeffer is the author of CRAZY FOR GOD-How >> I Grew Up As One Of The Elect, Helped Found The Religious >> Right, And Lived To Take All (Or Almost All) Of It Back. Now >> in paperback. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> AOL Search: Your one stop for directions, recipes and all >> other Holiday needs. 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