Brother David: I liked your post to J. It is true, that perhaps we fundamental preachers use expressions that are not verbatim quotes from the Bible context, but these truths are expressed even though they do not say them exactly. Not to refute Brother J, but there is nothing wrong with tradition if it doesn't violate Biblical teaching. By the bye, I really enjoy the posts on this forum when they are not argumentative. We can glean a lot from the ideas of other godly men. Because of Calvary, yours, Delmer G. Lawson Jesus loves you, and I do too